Union Strong: Cory McCray on Trades, Grit & Second Chances

Maryland State Senator and IBEW Local 24 leader Cory V. McCray joins Rich and Dan to share how a paid electrical apprenticeship rewired his life—from Baltimore City and the juvenile system to business owner and public service. Cory breaks down how union apprenticeships work, why mentors and discipline matter, and how practical pathways can lift families and entire communities. A grounded, honest guide for anyone who cares about second chances and real opportunity. 

Sponsored by Daniel McGhee and the Victory Team 

Guest Bio:  

Cory V. McCray is a Maryland State Senator, husband, and father of four who completed an IBEW Local 24 electrical apprenticeship before launching a career in business and public service. He’s the author of The Apprenticeship That Saved My Life and serves as a business agent and vice president within his local, championing working families, mentorship, and scalable pathways to the middle class.  

Main Topics: 

·         How a paid union apprenticeship provides wages, benefits, and schooling without debt. 

·         Discipline, mentors, and “learning to listen” as success multipliers on the job site and in life. 

·         Differences between premier union apprenticeships and other pathways, plus common pitfalls. 

·         Moving from limited exposure to leadership: business owner, union officer, and senator. 

·         Building pipelines for data centers and future infrastructure—and why Maryland needs more tradespeople now. 

·         Recovery, reprogramming habits, and choosing environments that support growth. 

·     

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Chapters

• 0:00 10 Years of the Show
• 1:29 Dan Bennett opens: Cory’s journey from apprentice to senator
• 3:04 Growing up in Baltimore; Mom’s push into apprenticeships; IBEW Local 24 acceptance
• 7:59 Paid to work, paid to learn: wages, benefits, book money incentive
• 11:29 Union vs. non-union pathways; avoiding “stuck” apprentice traps
• 14:59 “It literally saved my life”: juvenile/adult system to a new trajectory
• 17:29 Mentorship, teamwork, and learning from journeymen leaders
• 20:59 Business agent role; what locals actually do (contracts, grievances, organizing)
• 26:29 Explosive demand: new apprentices, big projects, data centers
• 31:49 AI, tech change, and why trades remain essential
• 34:19 Writing the book: industry, agents, publisher; launch milestones & sellouts
• 36:34 Sponsor: Daniel McGhee & The Victory Team (real estate; victoryteamsells.com)
• 43:49 Audiobook: Cory narrates his story
• 52:34 Recovery spaces; habits, environments, and reprogramming life
• 57:39 Helping friends into the trades; failing forward; starting a union-signatory company
• 1:07:56 Where to buy: theapprenticeshipcheatcode.com, local & national retailers
• 1:14:15 End • Wrap, thanks, and closing credits (supporters)

Transcript

Wendy & Rich 0:00
Hey, everyone is rich Bennett. Can you believe it? The show is turning 10 this year. I am so grateful for each and every one of you who've tuned in, shared an episode, or even joined the conversation over the years. You're the reason that this podcast has grown into what it is today. Together, we've shared laughs, tears, tears, and moments that truly matter. So I want to thank you for being part of this journey. Let's make the next 10 years even better. Coming to you from the Freedom Federal Credit Union Studios Harford County Living Presence, conversations with rich Bennett. 

No, no, no. It's who it is. 

Dan Bennett 1:01
Is it time for the welcome to? Yeah. If you 

Rich Bennett 1:02
want to. 

Dan Bennett 1:03
Okay, welcome to conversations with rich Bennett. I'm not rich Bennett. I'm Dan Bennett. I'm his son, but he's here. And so is my good union brother here, Senator Cory McCray. This is an introduction that was written by the man to my right. So if it's good credit him, if it's bad, you can blame me. What if the most powerful cheat code for a good life isn't luck or a four-year degree, it's a paid apprenticeship that rewires your future? Today's gas grew up in Baltimore City, bumped up against the juvenile justice system, and found his way forward with a union card, a tool belt, and a mission. 

Cory McCray 1:40
He 

Dan Bennett 1:40
went from electrical apprentice to business owner to the Maryland State Senate, still the only member of the General Assembly who actually completed an apprenticeship, and he's made it his life's work to open that same door for others. Cory V McCray is a devoted husband and father of four, a policy champion who fights for working families and the author of the apprenticeship that saved my life, a candid memoir meets guide that shows exactly how hands-on training, discipline, and real opportunity can transform a kid, a career and a We're diving into the moment that flipped his trajectory, what the trades told him about 

Cory McCray 2:19
community. 

Dan Bennett 2:19
leadership, and why apprenticeships aren't a consolation prize, very launch pad. If you care about second chances, practical pathways, and building a stronger community from the ground up, you're going to love this conversation with Rich Bennett, Dan Bennett, and Cory McCray. 

Rich Bennett 2:35
You know what? I might have to just turn everything over to you and change it to conversations with Danny 

Dan Bennett 2:40
Bennett. And that's with a fairly sore throat if it's not coming through. 

Rich Bennett 2:44
It's 

Dan Bennett 2:45
a little 

Rich Bennett 2:46
sandwich 

Dan Bennett 2:46
man. 

Rich Bennett 2:46
shit 

Dan Bennett 2:46
I had a fun weekend and I'm not sick. Don't I'm not going to elaborate. How fun weekend gave me a sore throat? 

Rich Bennett 2:54
It must have been a concert wherever you were yelling. 

Cory McCray 2:57
Soccer 

Dan Bennett 2:57
games? West Ham losing 

Cory McCray 2:59
three no. 

Rich Bennett 3:00
What's your gotcha? Well of course, first of all, thanks for coming man. Appreciate it. And before we get into the book or anything like that, tell everybody a little bit that yourself. 

Cory McCray 3:12
Growing 

Rich Bennett 3:13
up, what was it like and so forth? 

Cory McCray 3:14
Well first day and I just want to say thank you for that introduction. I got to bring you every way I go. Oh, this point. 

Rich Bennett 3:19
I'm the one 

Cory McCray 3:20
took 

Rich Bennett 3:20
that Dan 

Cory McCray 3:20
the 

Rich Bennett 3:21
thing up. 

Dan Bennett 3:23
Wow to what I was 

Cory McCray 3:24
He 

Dan Bennett 3:24
reading. 

Cory McCray 3:24
didn't let me get to him Rich. First just, just thank you for your service is the most important thing. 

Rich Bennett 3:29
All my honor. 

Cory McCray 3:30
And the second thing is it's like, wow. When I heard what I can see what it was being read, I was like, wow, born and raised in the city of Baltimore rich. I graduated from fair my heart for right there. Harvard in 25. For folks that's familiar with Baltimore city. As Diana stated, I live with my wife Dimitri. We live in Overly. I live there with my four children. I got a Kennedy Reagan C. J. Embrison 18 16 11 and 10. And I tell folks rich by the grace of God that I had a mom that didn't give up on her son. 

Rich Bennett 4:02
Good. 

Cory McCray 4:03
My mom after graduating from high school reached out to the Morone Department of Labor, asked them for every apprenticeship program in the state of Maryland had me go fill out applications. And luckily, I was able to get accepted into the IVW International Brotherhood of Electroworkers local 24. And 

Rich Bennett 4:21
you were still in school at this time? 

Cory McCray 4:23
Graduated from high school graduated from. 

Rich Bennett 4:24
And your mother did 

Cory McCray 4:25
And 

Rich Bennett 4:25
this. 

Cory McCray 4:25
my mother was the one that showed initiative. 

Rich Bennett 4:29
Wow, 

Cory McCray 4:30
But what happens is that experience going through that apprenticeship rich, what I would say is it took me from the limited exposure access that I had in the four blocks that I was so familiar with and put me around folks that could now be 

Rich Bennett 4:46
right. 

Cory McCray 4:46
considered as my mentors taught me what a work ethic is. It's not just also taught about teamwork because at the end of the day you don't work by yourself but you're working around other individuals, 

Rich Bennett 4:56
Right. 

Cory McCray 4:57
and there's so many lessons that I was able to learn. Some of the folks that I was working around, they had corner stores, they had rental property things of that nature, and rich, I would be working to my right, working to my left and say they're no smarter than I am. And that's why I don't know myself duplicating the same things that I saw might not have talked as much as I do right now, but one of the things is I do know how to pay attention, and that's what I was doing 

Rich Bennett 5:21
that 

Cory McCray 5:21
with 

Rich Bennett 5:22
important 

Cory McCray 5:22
ship. 

Rich Bennett 5:23
That's important, I mean, especially aligning yourself with them. 

Cory McCray 5:30
Yeah, 

Rich Bennett 5:31
because Henry Ford, he's not the one that really created. And who's the other one was Einstein, but they all aligned themselves with people that I don't want to say smarter. They didn't have all the answers. So you allow yourself with 

Cory McCray 5:45
people that 

Rich Bennett 5:46
the 

Cory McCray 5:47
and everybody wants to work everybody. 

Rich Bennett 5:50
Yes, 

Cory McCray 5:51
to be around to where I always say is 80. They might got some cousins, they might got some folks that slaggers, but at end of the day, people want to be around people that are working. 

Rich Bennett 6:00
So when your mother mentioned the apprenticeship program 

Cory McCray 6:04
programs, 

Rich Bennett 6:05
was it electrical that you always wanted to get into or at the time where you're like, whatever's available? 

Cory McCray 6:11
Yeah, so Rich, when I think of this dorn that time, I think it was trying to figure out how to do something constructive. I just wasn't familiar, especially like we didn't have a lot of electricians in my neighborhood. This wasn't something that you saw every day. So I just wanted to do something that was constructive and could take me out of the trajectory that I was headed on. The thing that I think about was it wasn't being able to do electrical work. It was the wage scale. It was them laying out very clearly. If you do this, if you show up with a good attitude, if you show up to work every day, here's what you make as a first year apprentice. You continue that same thing that you're doing, you then move to a second year and here's the 

Rich Bennett 6:51
rate 

Cory McCray 6:52
that you pay. And I'm sitting here asking myself the question, Rich, how are they able to first pay that wage? Because I didn't have an understanding of that a young... 

Rich Bennett 7:00
Mhmm. 

Cory McCray 7:01
The there are employers that have a business model that value having the trained workforce. 

Rich Bennett 7:10
Right. 

Cory McCray 7:11
But being able to lay out five years and being able to see it a little bit more clear, I thought they were hustling me if I couldn't 

Rich Bennett 7:20
Mhmm. 

Cory McCray 7:20
be honest with you. 

Rich Bennett 7:21
Okay. 

That's right. 

Cory McCray 7:27
But there's 

Rich Bennett 7:30
some type of gimmick. If you don't mind me asking, what year was 

Cory McCray 7:33
This is 2003 through 2008 as when I went through to your apprenticeship. So 

Rich Bennett 7:37
this? Okay. 

Cory McCray 7:37
$12 is what I started out. I think first year start out like $21 now. So like $12, 

Dan Bennett 7:43
I 

Cory McCray 7:43
yeah. 

Dan Bennett 7:43
started in 2017. I think it was $15 an hour. 

Cory McCray 7:46
Yeah. 

Dan Bennett 7:47
That was around a time when 15 bucks an hour is like a big 

Cory McCray 7:49
sell. 

Dan Bennett 7:49
political 

Cory McCray 7:50
Yeah. Yep. 

Dan Bennett 7:51
Yep. A federal scale. And I'm like, oh, I can do that. I have to drive to Frederick. That's the first place I was driving to. 

Rich Bennett 7:55
But here's the good thing 

Dan Bennett 7:57
that. And... Gladly 

Rich Bennett 7:57
about 

Dan Bennett 7:58
drive out there now for 50 as a journeyman. 

Cory McCray 8:00
Exactly. 

Rich Bennett 8:00
And we've talked about apprenticeship programs on this a lot. 

Cory McCray 8:03
Mhmm. 

Rich Bennett 8:04
And I'm happy to start... You know, you're seeing some of the schools adopt them now as well. 

Cory McCray 8:09
Mhmm. 

Rich Bennett 8:11
But we'll get into that in a minute. But I think with when it comes to apprenticeship programs, there's something that you guys don't have to do as suppose if you go to college and get a degree. And that's paying back. 

Cory McCray 8:31
It's 

Rich Bennett 8:32
so 

Cory McCray 8:33
huge. I think that when we think about loans just in the country, one of the things that crippled divorce rates, things of that nature is how do you handle money. And one of the things that I think about is when I was going through that apprenticeship, I'm like, you're going to pay me. You're going to pay me to go to work every day. I'm going to 

Rich Bennett 8:50
school and teach 

Cory McCray 8:50
go to 

Rich Bennett 8:51
me 

Cory McCray 8:51
And you're going to pay me to go to school. I was like, wow. Help me understand like all of 

Dan Bennett 8:57
the 

Cory McCray 8:57
this. 

Dan Bennett 8:58
camera. 

Cory McCray 8:58
And I'm where is the camera 

Rich Bennett 9:00
like, yeah, 

Cory McCray 9:00
is all I kept there? Oh, damn, like 

Rich Bennett 9:01
It 

Cory McCray 9:01
this 

Rich Bennett 9:02
could 

Cory McCray 9:02
camp. 

Rich Bennett 9:02
be. It sounds like it could be 

Cory McCray 9:03
Yeah, 

Rich Bennett 9:03
a gimmick. 

Cory McCray 9:03
it could be. And I kept thinking to myself, like, I'm getting this education. The only thing I did have to pay for it, so I want to be up front, was my books. And we had this thing, if you get a 93 average, you get your book money. I didn't do well in my first year, Rich. I'll be honest, like, because my level of seriousness for school, I just didn't apply myself. I 

Rich Bennett 9:23
Right. 

Cory McCray 9:24
found myself as one of them people that had a fail to test. So our thing was, if you fail three tests, you're out at a program. And I can remember, my first year apprentice teacher, named was Horace Ellis. And he had asked me the question, well, why don't I see you in our coach class? So the teachers were even going above and beyond, because they were offering coach class to folks that may not have understand some of the problems solving or things that we were doing. And you could then catch up from that standpoint. At my third year, I got my book money back. So I did get a 93, hard as hell to get it there, but like, I did get my book money back. So imagine your third year at being totally free of cost. And I want you, when you said that, y'all are going to pay me to get an education. That's, that's not reciprocal at a university or a community 

Rich Bennett 10:05
of. Yeah, 

Cory McCray 10:05
kind you're not working typically or you're working at night or something like that to try to figure it out, try to make ends meet or things that I nature. Well, we didn't have to go through that myself and day. 

Rich Bennett 10:14
It reminds me of the military. On the 

Cory McCray 10:16
so somewhat it's a lived 

Rich Bennett 10:18
job 

Cory McCray 10:18
experience. It's 

Rich Bennett 10:18
training. 

Cory McCray 10:18
a lived experience, 

Rich Bennett 10:19
Yeah, 

Cory McCray 10:19
exactly. Yup. 

Rich Bennett 10:20
Damn, 

Dan Bennett 10:21
we also have challenge coins just like the military. 

Cory McCray 10:23
We do have challenge. 

Rich Bennett 10:24
Oh, okay, that you know what the funny thing is, I said to myself, self. Shit, should I bring my challenge coin in case Corey calls me, 

Dan Bennett 10:32
but 

Rich Bennett 10:33
I did not. 

Cory McCray 10:34
Okay, okay, 

Rich Bennett 10:34
okay, I didn't break it because. 

Cory McCray 10:36
all 

Dan Bennett 10:36
Okay, 

Cory McCray 10:36
right, 

Rich Bennett 10:36
you're not recording in the bar. 

Cory McCray 10:38
all 

Rich Bennett 10:38
So 

Cory McCray 10:38
right. Okay, 

Rich Bennett 10:39
there 

Dan Bennett 10:40
might not even be, 

Cory McCray 10:41
I'll be ready next time. I'll be ready 

Rich Bennett 10:42
Let's 

Cory McCray 10:42
next. 

Rich Bennett 10:43
do the challenge coins the same way we do in the military or not, 

Dan Bennett 10:46
Yeah, 

Rich Bennett 10:46
you know? 

Dan Bennett 10:47
sort of there's a whole other little thing called beans, but that's a whole different of worms. 

Cory McCray 10:53
kind 

Dan Bennett 10:53
We have to bring 

Cory McCray 10:53
a 

Dan Bennett 10:54
like an old 

Cory McCray 10:54
beener 

Dan Bennett 10:55
local 28 

Cory McCray 10:55
from 

Dan Bennett 10:56
to talk about that one. 

Rich Bennett 10:57
Okay, all right, so with with the apprenticeship program going through a union. 

if I'm wrong, let me know, but I think 

Cory McCray 11:07
And 

Rich Bennett 11:07
the big difference saying, whether you, if you're doing it union through a school, I think the big thing that the union teaches you that the school doesn't, again, correct me for wrong is discipline. 

Cory McCray 11:22
So one of the things that I was saying, I talk about this in the book, so I try to lay out each approach. But first, I think that is good that you go through something do I want the Cadillac version? Do I want the premier version? The premier version is going through a local union apprenticeship program. And what I do is I lay it out like some of them have 

Rich Bennett 11:40
cars, 

Cory McCray 11:40
split So that wasn't what me and Dan went 

Rich Bennett 11:42
right? 

Cory McCray 11:42
through. So where the employer will pay 50% or 60% and then the apprentice has to pay for them to be able to receive that education. That's not what we endure. And some of them actually have like a full, so you got to remember if we were ever laid off, I was never laid off as a apprentice, but if I was, I just go back to that school and I don't have to work out a new agreement with an employer where if you're not union, you have that agreement at that time with that respective employer and you go and find a solicit work and you still have to think about what does your apprenticeship payments look like to you of organizations. Then you have some, and I also talk about this one, this is where it gets a little bit tricky because they take advantage of you. There are folks like myself. I don't know if Dan knew about it, but like let's say you didn't know about our apprenticeship, but you heart for a contractor. What happens then is, is that you could be working, but you can't receive the schooling part of it. 

Rich Bennett 12:35
So 

Cory McCray 12:36
what they do is they're manipulating the system because if you never get the schooling part of it, then you aren't matriculating to the next level. So you may be apprentice for seven, eight years out there simply because he didn't 

Rich Bennett 12:49
that. 

Cory McCray 12:49
do 

Rich Bennett 12:49
Wow. 

Cory McCray 12:50
So I try to lay that out because what happens is, if I would have walked in there and I would have went down that direction that I just talked about, I wouldn't have known until I got around someone else. And maybe Dan might have been in his third or fourth year, and then he's explaining to me, hey, you should have went through this one or you should have went through this one because you would have been getting the schooling part of it too. 

Rich Bennett 13:08
Wow. 

Yeah, you could ask questions anytime you want, Dan. 

Dan Bennett 13:14
Oh, I know. I'm taking it and earlier, you asked a question that I was going to ask when you asked about what year he started. 

Rich Bennett 13:22
Oh, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to 

Dan Bennett 13:24
No, 

Rich Bennett 13:24
steal your 

Dan Bennett 13:24
you're good. You're good. You're 

Rich Bennett 13:26
damn. 

Dan Bennett 13:26
good. Sinking. 

Yeah, I mean, you, you probably have more questions than I would. 

Rich Bennett 13:33
Well, like 

Cory McCray 13:34
we 

Rich Bennett 13:34
I said, 

Cory McCray 13:35
went through the same thing, 

Dan Bennett 13:36
but I'm happy to interject when I can, but he's answering the same way that I would. 

Rich Bennett 13:40
We talked about this a lot, but in Africa, you were on the one round table. 

Dan Bennett 13:49
I was an apprentice at that time. I feel like I would go back in time and if I looked at myself then I'd be like 'Where are you talking about you?' 

Cory McCray 13:56
'Where are 

Dan Bennett 13:57
And you're 

Rich Bennett 13:57
you actually--' 

Dan Bennett 13:57
out of your element. 

Rich Bennett 13:58
With the apprenticeship 

Cory McCray 13:59
program, 

Rich Bennett 14:00
for electricians, I be 'W'. 

Cory McCray 14:01
Yeah. 24. 

Rich Bennett 14:04
How long is the apprenticeship program for? 

Cory McCray 14:06
years. That's a great question because I went through five years. 

Dan Bennett 14:10
That's five 

Cory McCray 14:10
You went through five years? Okay. 

Dan Bennett 14:11
Think. 

Cory McCray 14:11
And 

Dan Bennett 14:12
now it still is, but it's going to be four years. Yeah, 

Cory McCray 14:14
four years is where they're moving too. So you have-- 60C 

Dan Bennett 14:18
might already be four 

Cory McCray 14:19
Yeah. 

Dan Bennett 14:19
years? 

Cory McCray 14:19
And I try to lay that 

Dan Bennett 14:20
They're 

Cory McCray 14:20
out. 

Dan Bennett 14:21
all 

Cory McCray 14:21
Apprenticeships 

Dan Bennett 14:21
different. 

Cory McCray 14:21
can be a variation of years. So you could find yourself in a three-aid program. You can find yourself in a five-year program. The norm is probably about four, but it can be any way from three to five years. 

Rich Bennett 14:34
Tricky 

Cory McCray 14:35
question. Tricky 

Rich Bennett 14:36
Yes. 

Cory McCray 14:36
question. 

Rich Bennett 14:37
So if your mother 

Cory McCray 14:38
Uh-huh. 

Rich Bennett 14:39
did not-- The apprenticeship program. 

Cory McCray 14:42
We'll 

Rich Bennett 14:43
be doing today. 

Cory McCray 14:43
I definitely would not be in this position. I tell folks-- and Dan kind of scratched at the surface that I was very heavily engaged in the juvenile system. As a juvenile, even in the adult system. And I would even go on to saying like, I turn 18 over to Baltimore City Jail. So while most folks are experiencing a prom, experiencing a ring dance, or graduation. 

Rich Bennett 15:08
I 

Cory McCray 15:08
I fell 

Rich Bennett 15:08
fell in love with 

Cory McCray 15:09
myself in a very challenging situation where I was over there with a number of juvenile face-and-murder, attempted murder, 

Rich Bennett 15:16
them. 

Cory McCray 15:16
handgun 

Rich Bennett 15:16
Damn. 

Cory McCray 15:17
charges, and turning-- and over what we call it was L-section. And then, by myself, going with the adults once I turn 18, I went over to a tea or called J. I. So-- 

Rich Bennett 15:29
Wow. 

Cory McCray 15:29
Yes. And saying that to your question, what would you be doing if this did not find-- if you did not find your way to this? I do believe that there probably would have been two alternatives. 

Rich Bennett 15:41
Which are? 

Cory McCray 15:42
Probably not here with you or probably in a long sentence in someone's whole to sell, or J. O. at that 

Rich Bennett 15:49
So 

Cory McCray 15:50
time. 

Rich Bennett 15:50
technically you could say that the apprenticeship program saves your life? 

Cory McCray 15:54
Literally. 

Dan Bennett 15:54
Mm-hmm. 

Cory McCray 15:55
Literally. And the funny thing, Rich, is that the title is the apprenticeship that saved my life because it really did. 

Rich Bennett 16:04
Am I forgetting about that? 

Cory McCray 16:05
But-- But I tell folks about the book. 

many people that have finished the apprenticeship, and I don't care what generation they come out of. I just talked to a retiree, and he said, "Cory, I do not know what I would be doing if I did not find out a apprenticeship at that moment." And then they'll go in and tell me their experience because it's like, some of these folks I've known for a couple of decades now, 

Rich Bennett 16:28
So 

Cory McCray 16:28
and I've never heard how did you get into the apprenticeship? Who wasn't that told you about the apprenticeship? Did you accidentally bump into the apprenticeship when that standpoint, but there will walk down that lane? So a lot of folks, especially that are in the trades, can find themselves relating because they don't know what would have been on the other end of this if they didn't get into this program. 

Rich Bennett 16:47
Well, thank you, Cory. You know what this sounds like to me? 

Cory McCray 16:49
What's that? 

Rich Bennett 16:49
This sounds like to me, you have all this stuff for a second book. 

Cory McCray 16:54
* appeal to SLPM 

Dan Bennett 16:54
stone* Stories. 

Cory McCray 16:55
This was hard as hell. 

Dan Bennett 16:56
Yeah. 

Cory McCray 16:56
Let me be clear. This 

Rich Bennett 16:58
But 

Cory McCray 16:58
was 

Rich Bennett 16:58
that's 

Cory McCray 16:58
three years. This was- This is a guidebook, a blueprint, some level of direction, and when I say like the target artist, I love that students are going to read 

Rich Bennett 17:08
a- 

Cory McCray 17:08
this, but that in a day like, and that's why I try to make it very easy to flow through. But the real people that I really want to dig into is God and his counselors, teachers, mentors, parents, simply because when you look at the folks in the education system and I love my teachers, my wife is a teacher, they went through a four-year 

Rich Bennett 17:26
Right. 

Cory McCray 17:26
institution. So these are the young- These are the folks that are God-now-young people, and giving them direction, and if you ask them, "Everybody- I don't keep you Republican Democrat. Everybody loves the word of apprenticeship." 

Rich Bennett 17:36
Right. Oh, yeah. 

Cory McCray 17:37
Ask them to articulate three sentences on it, though. And they won't be able to say, "Where do you find apprenticeship set?" Most people wouldn't say they're their own Department of Labor. Or, "No matter what state you're in, it's the Department of Labor that house these specific programs." 

Rich Bennett 17:50
Right. 

Cory McCray 17:51
"Would you be able to say like, hey, what drove Dan to it? That's what a question that I would ask you Dan like, "I know that it was the wage scale." And somebody clearly being able to say, "Here's what five years look like over a period of time. If you do what 

Rich Bennett 18:03
Mm-hmm. 

Cory McCray 18:03
you're- To do. I didn't even know Rich about like the health benefits. I didn't know about the retirement, because you don't think about that as a 

Rich Bennett 18:11
'19. 

Cory McCray 18:11
18, 

Rich Bennett 18:11
Bounce." 

Cory McCray 18:12
You don't care about having a health care, you don't care about having a retirement 'cause I gotta get to that part. But now that I got 4 kids, when I got 

Rich Bennett 18:18
That's important, 

Cory McCray 18:19
30 

Rich Bennett 18:19
doesn't it? 

Cory McCray 18:20
dollars, and like our retirement isn't paid out of the check like most people's are. So most people will have a wage. Let's say your wage is 25 dollars or 30 dollars. That health is then taken out of that 25, 30 hours is on top. Each average retirement works like that and our healthcare works. 

Rich Bennett 18:36
Oh nice. 

Cory McCray 18:38
That's why I went dancing $15, you know, package was like. a reality and that's why I hate you saying it all nice, but I'm like, this can't be real 

Dan Bennett 18:46
It's 

Cory McCray 18:46
like. Whoah, 

Dan Bennett 18:48
still to this day. 

Cory McCray 18:48
Still, yeah, it is a nice 

Dan Bennett 18:50
sister somebody wake me 

Cory McCray 18:51
up, that is set up, but it has been a system that's been in place for over 5 decades with the local 24 foot, local 24. 

Rich Bennett 18:59
The 

Cory McCray 18:59
28 but like, this isn't not just and I don't want to stare everybody to the lectures. I would love for you to be electricians, but this is the carpenters, this is the painters, this is the roofer, this is still workers, this is 

Rich Bennett 19:10
trade 

Cory McCray 19:10
any, any, any trade and you find what's happening is people see our system and then trying to duplicate it. So they're trying to figure out I see healthcare workers trying to figure out like, how do we create a apprenticeship style. You see folks in the public sector trying to figure out like, how do you create this apprenticeship style and I also tell folks how they go wrong. So what happens the difference between this is very important because what happens is these folks that are trying to model a system that's been here for decades at this point. They don't realize that there's ownership from the employee side and the employer side from that standpoint. So the employer is collectively have to be in the game. A lot of them don't want to put two feet in the water. What happens is they don't my government put in two feet in the water. They don't mind, no, profits put in two feet in the water form, but they don't put skin in the game. And that's what they have to do collectively because that's what these employers do. I don't care if you're union or not union. What happens is, the not union is pulling together, union is pulling together and they're building a system that then works for everybody. 

Rich Bennett 20:14
Wow. So this book is when you mentioned, it's not just for people that are going through an apprenticeship 

Cory McCray 20:23
program. 

Rich Bennett 20:24
Like you said, mentor. So basically it's for everybody. And I believe that because I believe everybody should have a mentor. 

Cory McCray 20:32
It's actually a chapter in hand, specifically about mentors like 

Rich Bennett 20:36
real, 

Cory McCray 20:37
rich. And so I do some storytelling because I want to lay it out at such a granular 

Rich Bennett 20:41
okay, 

Cory McCray 20:41
level that 

Rich Bennett 20:41
right 

Cory McCray 20:41
anyone can understand. So I'll start with the mentorship chat. I talk about folks was a court. Well, who was your mentor when you was growing up? And I say, I really didn't have a mentor. And then I realized I did have a mentor at the end of the day, they were teaching me the best way they knew how to 

Rich Bennett 20:56
write. 

Cory McCray 20:56
So I lay out a story about my brother. And I can remember me getting my grew up in the urban jurisdiction. So this does happen. I got my bike took. So I'm like 11, 12 years old, some bigger kid takes my bike and I go get my big brother. And he then says, you have to fight him. And I'm like, what do you mean I got to fight that. Like dance big 

Dan Bennett 21:13
No, 

Cory McCray 21:13
into me. 

Dan Bennett 21:15
I'm not 

Cory McCray 21:15
And 

Dan Bennett 21:15
taking your 

Cory McCray 21:17
what happens 

Dan Bennett 21:18
body. 

Cory McCray 21:18
is, he's trying to teach me to lesson, do not ever let someone take willingly take your stuff. And that's how I fight in the general assembly folks will say, you're worried why are you so passionate because I'm fighting for my people the only way that I know how to. And that's what. So I lay that story out, but then I also talk about people like Frank Vosel. And what did Frank Vosel teach me? He was a person that I knew through my little union at check one of my first journey in that I was able to work with. But Ed had told me like, when I see this guy work his ass off, when I say how hard he worked, he made me see it so much more clear. He was not only a journey, but sometimes he will run the projects and rich, he wouldn't be scared to get in the mud, to get 

Rich Bennett 21:58
gym. 

Cory McCray 21:58
in the And that's what I saw, like that's leadership. 

Rich Bennett 22:02
That's a good leader. 

Cory McCray 22:02
That's a good. So like, I speak to that piece of it and talk about it. I talk about Mike Rolly, who I worked with at Brown and Heim and at North of Gremlin, when I was working there. So when they start thinking, well, Corey, why'd you buy your first house? It was just through conversations that I was having or hearing conversations with other people and then being able to say, well, Mike told me this Frank told me this Ed told me these different versions. And that's why I consider them mentors. But like you said, in every apprenticeship, you're going to find those folks and rich. I then have a chapter about working with difficult people. Everybody's not going to be a mentor by. End 

Rich Bennett 22:40
up working with somebody that's difficult 

Cory McCray 22:42
and inevitable that you're going to work with so, so you have to be able to navigate those waters, especially because I ran into a journey. And as a journeyman, they don't have as much to lose as you do as a apprentice. Your job is the get to the German, like they talked about the teacher when you're going through the teeth. I don't care what the teacher already got their, uh, high school diploma, you gotta get yours. 

Rich Bennett 23:00
Yeah. 

Cory McCray 23:00
And it's the same thing with that, but I kind of lay out where I fell short, and how I now navigate 

Rich Bennett 23:06
difficulty. 

Cory McCray 23:06
working with 

Rich Bennett 23:08
So, with Ibi, 

what's your role there now? 

Cory McCray 23:16
So I am what they were consider a business agent. I work for the local union itself. 

Rich Bennett 23:22
So, explain 

Cory McCray 23:23
is. 

Rich Bennett 23:23
what a business 

Cory McCray 23:24
So explain what a, because you're right. 'Cause like, I didn't think about that. Folks in the list in the audience is asking the same question. So when a local union, they have what we call a business manager. They're the ones that negotiate contracts. They're the ones that, um, events are held grievances are taking place. Some goes on on a job. Then that business manager has a team of folks that are helping them. Our local is over 2,000 members. 

Rich Bennett 23:49
Damn, you guys are that big. 

Cory McCray 23:50
So 

Rich Bennett 23:50
Yeah. 

Dan Bennett 23:51
it's close to closer to 3000. 

Cory McCray 23:52
Yeah. So it's huge. So 

Dan Bennett 23:53
local. 

Cory McCray 23:53
it's a big 

Dan Bennett 23:54
We swore in another 91 members at the last 

Cory McCray 23:56
So 

Dan Bennett 23:56
meeting. 

Cory McCray 23:57
making sure that our local union members are serviced in the way that they're supposed to be service, whether that's through grievances, whatever that's through contracts, whatever that, whether that's through organizing, whatever that is. And that's one of my responsibilities. I hope I articulated it, right? 

Rich Bennett 24:10
No, no, you did. That's because a lot of people don't realize. You know, they think just you go through the apprenticeship program. Well, then you're just working out in the field all the time. No, with a union. And I only know this from my father, being in steel workers union. 

Cory McCray 24:25
Nice. 

Rich Bennett 24:25
There's different positions that filled. There's contracts have to be worked out. 

Cory McCray 24:31
Oh, there's 

Rich Bennett 24:33
the lobbying and everything. There's so many different things that people don't realize that. 

Dan Bennett 24:38
But 

Rich Bennett 24:38
I think that's what makes it fun. 

Cory McCray 24:40
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I tell folks. 

Dan Bennett 24:44
And we all start as just electricians. 

Cory McCray 24:45
And we all start as just a lecture. So I can remember asking them asking me to come into the office. And at and in the day, like, what's the worst? Like I go back and work in my tools. I was like, oh, that's fun. You know what I mean? Like, I can do that. You know, so like at and in the day, what I would tell these young folks is try new things. Walk to the things that you're uncomfortable with because that's what I feel like true living is. That's what I feel like living to your full purpose is from that standpoint. And when I think about like. At some point rich, I started the question, well, how did this happen? How do we have these wages? How do we have these this healthcare? How do we have these benefits? And I realized there were people before me. They were fighting for the same thing. And now I'm so engaged. I serve as the vice president of my local, but I served and I give back so much because I want to preserve it. I do not know if it's my son, I don't know if it's my nephew. I don't know if it's my grandson grand order that may want the same opportunity that I was giving back in 2003 going through a 2008 and I have to keep that going. And I think that it's a number of us in the local, you Dan included like that feel the same way I've been given a gift. How do I make sure that I've preserved that gift for the next generation? 

Rich Bennett 25:55
you said or Dan said there's what all three that 

Cory McCray 25:59
3000. 

Rich Bennett 25:59
almost 3000 people 

Cory McCray 25:59
Yeah, 

Rich Bennett 26:00
are so when you went in, how many? Just 

Cory McCray 26:03
We were 

Rich Bennett 26:04
let me 

Cory McCray 26:04
it's it's it's topsy, terribly, but I've only seen it teeter like the peak at one point in time. The highest prior to right now is like 2,200. 

Rich Bennett 26:13
know 

Cory McCray 26:13
And 

Rich Bennett 26:13
if you want to come. 

Cory McCray 26:13
that was probably back in 11 and 12. If I can remember right the economy is like about to break like 

Rich Bennett 26:20
Right. 

Cory McCray 26:20
housing had fell apart, but like it was doing really good. We had Aberdeen at that point in time, so Aberdeen, Brake was just getting started. Fort Me was going, Brandon Shores was going, all these projects were going to Aberdeen had about 300, 400 electricians on it just itself. 

Rich Bennett 26:36
Yeah, 

Cory McCray 26:38
and and so like those types of projects was going and we peaked at 2,200 back then and right now this thing is going gangbusters like when I say we got calls that we can't even feel we don't have enough electricians. We just accepted a class of apprentices. I think it was north of like close to 200. I felt like that just came in this September. So this September when we did 

Rich Bennett 26:57
wow. 

Cory McCray 26:58
Like that that is like a lot of first year apprentices. So like we're moving in uncharted. this moment and the reason why is because not only do we have the regular jobs sites that's going up the supermarkets things that I nature. You find us a lot of data centers 

Rich Bennett 27:13
At 

Cory McCray 27:14
that's taking place right now, and this isn't just something that's going to happen for like the next six or nine months. This is probably the next three 

Rich Bennett 27:20
or five each. 

Cory McCray 27:21
We have just as the state of Maryland and what happens is I don't even know if we're ready then like we're just not ready as a state and when I say ready I'm talking about the pipeline so the pipeline's not ready and what happens is you're gonna find folks from Delaware PA that'll come here to Maryland and I want to say extract resources from our economy but it we could have did a better job of making sure that pipeline so we can Have folks Baltimore City 

Rich Bennett 27:46
County 

Cory McCray 27:46
Hartford At nature being able to get those textiles. 

Rich Bennett 27:50
How many different locals are in Maryland? 

Dan Bennett 27:53
We've got 24 is us 70 is like an outside local 410 is BGE 

Rich Bennett 28:00
Like 

Cory McCray 28:02
lime lime 

Rich Bennett 28:03
are 

Cory McCray 28:03
the people 

Rich Bennett 28:03
Okay, 

Dan Bennett 28:04
we're 

Rich Bennett 28:04
man. 

Dan Bennett 28:04
indoor wire 

Rich Bennett 28:05
Oh, okay. 

Dan Bennett 28:05
We're yeah, we 

Cory McCray 28:06
got two more. You got couple more 

Dan Bennett 28:08
Scary. Yes, 26 is 

Cory McCray 28:11
26. Yeah 

Dan Bennett 28:13
Right. 

Cory McCray 28:13
so like Montgomery 

Dan Bennett 28:15
I want to say 

Cory McCray 28:16
prestige 

Dan Bennett 28:16
is 317 

Cory McCray 28:17
307 you got 

Dan Bennett 28:18
307 

Cory McCray 28:19
307 

Dan Bennett 28:19
is 

Cory McCray 28:19
Weston Maryland. 

Dan Bennett 28:21
Yeah, and it might be a couple more 

Cory McCray 28:23
Then you got like folks to do like television. That's I be W You have some folks that are down at North grumman. That's I B W So the I B W is pretty 15. Oh, 

Dan Bennett 28:34
some of them are buddies 

Rich Bennett 28:37
So 

Cory McCray 28:37
I B W represents electrician, but they also represent some government workers. They also represent 

Rich Bennett 28:43
Workers, they 

Cory McCray 28:44
also represent folks that do cables so you put in install in 

Dan Bennett 28:48
Think I B W even 

Cory McCray 28:50
Television itself. Yeah 

Dan Bennett 28:51
think I B W even represents a Starbucks somewhere. 

Cory McCray 28:54
I think 

Dan Bennett 28:54
Or 

Cory McCray 28:54
I 

Dan Bennett 28:54
a coffee shop of some sort. Yeah, 

Cory McCray 28:56
yeah, so out our responsibility is to organize unorganized 

Dan Bennett 28:59
workers. Oh 

Rich Bennett 29:00
Wow Damn, okay, so now should you join? Are you and it cuz The word is getting out there more about apprenticeship per 

Cory McCray 29:10
Mm hmm. I agree. 

Rich Bennett 29:12
blow up. 

Cory McCray 29:12
I agree I think that what happens we went through a point in time where everybody was being pushed in the university 

Rich Bennett 29:17
Yes 

Cory McCray 29:17
all communities. And that's unfortunate because our responsibility is to make sure that you know Rich is going through high school that Rich is supposed to know about every Vib will career path and I consider us Bible as 

Rich Bennett 29:31
Very much so. 

Cory McCray 29:33
Yeah and and what happens is I think that we realized then history Just wasn't happening in the state of Maryland. This is across the country that we went through this phase And now I think that folks are realizing everybody's not gonna go there and what happens is the folks that are walking away with this debt And not able to find a job afterwards are also saying I don't feel like I got this I got I feel like they got the short end 

Rich Bennett 29:54
stay 

Cory McCray 29:54
of the Folks are having a real conversation about what else is out there and I actually think like The way we look at education is about to change as this generation that's in front of us is looking at How do you do things faster? They're looking at the debt that accumulates with it. They're gonna have a greater expectation of these universities to be able to perform a little bit quicker and get them out of Faster pace so they can get to the occupation 

Rich Bennett 30:21
What the end the thing is to when you go to a lot of these people at good a college afterwards to get that degree 

percentages very low by how many of them actually stay in that field. Yeah, or even finish side, 

Cory McCray 30:38
It's 

Rich Bennett 30:39
which is The case in the field because we're paying back the loads more and more 

Cory McCray 30:44
a 

Rich Bennett 30:45
But we 

Cory McCray 30:46
always hold down all 

Rich Bennett 30:46
time the trades are hurt My one of my best friends is in the HVAC field He's always having a hard 

Cory McCray 30:53
finding 

Rich Bennett 30:53
time The same with the construction field now the good thing is with electricians and and HVAC is somebody whose other ones Unlike like I mentioned before my father was in steel workers union. Well We know what happened with steel worker plants, so that's basically always gonna need electricity 

Cory McCray 31:16
You're 

Rich Bennett 31:17
you know, they're just they're looking at different ways to 

Dan Bennett 31:20
We have to fix 

Cory McCray 31:22
those robots We 

Dan Bennett 31:23
have to fix those robots 

Rich Bennett 31:28
I don't see her. Yeah, never mind. That's the 

Cory McCray 31:31
Whether 

Rich Bennett 31:32
it be solar or whatever you still got it's still electricity 

Cory McCray 31:36
Yeah, absolutely right. I think dad hit a home run right now when he says like you can't take your job of installing Putting the light fixtures in 

Rich Bennett 31:45
shipping 

Cory McCray 31:45
and But I also think about like AI as a lot of folks that are doing their jobs It looks it's gonna look very different and I ain't gonna say 10 years from now possibly two or 

Rich Bennett 31:55
years 

Cory McCray 31:55
three 

Rich Bennett 31:55
Oh, yeah 

Dan Bennett 32:01
we're building the 

Cory McCray 32:02
Yeah, 

Dan Bennett 32:02
data 

Cory McCray 32:02
the 

Dan Bennett 32:02
centers. 

Cory McCray 32:03
building, 

Dan Bennett 32:04
the 

Cory McCray 32:04
They, like, these are jobs that 

Rich Bennett 32:06
building. 

Cory McCray 32:06
just cannot, they, they may get more 

Rich Bennett 32:08
efficient. They've 

Cory McCray 32:08
gotten efficient over 

Rich Bennett 32:10
time, 

Cory McCray 32:10
but at any day, you cannot come and replace them. 

Rich Bennett 32:13
People don't need to be afraid of the AI. And you hear that, you know, people are 

Dan Bennett 32:16
a 

Rich Bennett 32:17
getting, 

Dan Bennett 32:17
lot of 

Rich Bennett 32:19
people think it's new, and AI's been around since the 40s. Yeah, but they're, 

Cory McCray 32:25
like, oh, no, 

Rich Bennett 32:25
oh, oh, the AI's taking it. 

Cory McCray 32:27
As a kid, 

Rich Bennett 32:28
we heard all, oh, robots are gonna take-- 

Cory McCray 32:31
like, the Jetsons. 

Rich Bennett 32:33
Yes, it's like, yeah, no, I better watch what I say here. 

Dan Bennett 32:39
It's not as drastic as people might make it out. 

Rich Bennett 32:42
No, no, you have to embrace it and use it to your-- 

Cory McCray 32:45
You're hitting it right. You're saying it the right way. Free of it. It's coming no matter what. It's, like, somebody telling me that cell phones, like, I remember cell phones is, like, I'm not getting a cell phone. I 

Rich Bennett 32:58
that. 

Cory McCray 32:58
don't want to do It was like, dude, the payphone is not gonna be here forever, you know? Like, it's just inevitable that you have to figure out how to move with that respect of 

Dan Bennett 33:07
Yeah. 

Cory McCray 33:07
time. 

Rich Bennett 33:07
Well, I got to live it. I was talking to somebody the other day, and they were mentioning-- 

She's not in here, so I can say it. Alexa. Yeah. Yeah, I was-- because I'm giving one of those away-- I like to give the Alexa things away 

Cory McCray 33:22
Okay. 

Rich Bennett 33:23
when I do giveaways for the podcast. 

Cory McCray 33:24
If 

Rich Bennett 33:25
somebody said, "Oh, we don't want that in our house because they can listen to you guys." Don't you guys have cameras 

Cory McCray 33:32
Yeah, 

Rich Bennett 33:32
that doorbell-- 

Cory McCray 33:33
yeah. 

Dan Bennett 33:33
I don't want an Alexa. 

Cory McCray 33:34
TVs. 

Rich Bennett 33:34
TVs. The phones. Internet your house? Guess what? They're listening. 

Cory McCray 33:40
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 33:40
It doesn't matter what you 

Dan Bennett 33:42
You are. 

Rich Bennett 33:42
think. 

Cory McCray 33:42
No, you're right. 

Rich Bennett 33:44
Devices? 

Cory McCray 33:45
Yep. 

Rich Bennett 33:45
Yeah. 

Cory McCray 33:45
They're very smart. 

Rich Bennett 33:46
All right, so with the book. What was the heart-- you said it took three years and right. What was the hardest part about, right? 

Cory McCray 33:53
Rich, what are the things that I would say is that I'm not in the book space, but I do love walking towards things. Never done before. I just feel like it's so fulfilling. But mine was being able to understand the book industry, how to write a book proposal, understand literary agents, understand the publishing space, and then I didn't realize there were so many editors. I didn't know that there was a structural editor, a line editor, a copy editor. I just thought that there were one person that kind of 

Rich Bennett 34:21
Oh, 

Cory McCray 34:21
helped. 

Rich Bennett 34:21
no. 

Dan Bennett 34:22
Job 

Cory McCray 34:23
Yeah. 

Dan Bennett 34:23
site. 

Cory McCray 34:23
It's his own 

Rich Bennett 34:24
And 

Cory McCray 34:24
job. 

Rich Bennett 34:24
don't let AI 

Cory McCray 34:26
it. 

Rich Bennett 34:26
edit 

Cory McCray 34:26
Yep, 

Rich Bennett 34:26
yep, yep. 

Cory McCray 34:27
And what happens then is being able to, at a granular level, understand the process. I feel really, really good. And I have so many friends that like, we'll walk up to you and say, "Man, I know somebody wrote a book." You know, that's 

Rich Bennett 34:41
difference. 

Cory McCray 34:41
a big 

Rich Bennett 34:41
Everybody's writing books. 

Cory McCray 34:42
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I'm just like, it's such a cool experience. But mine's was just understanding what took so long throughout the process. And I actually thought it was therapeutic. 

Rich Bennett 34:52
Oh, it is. Everybody I will throw I've had on. They talk about health. You know, it's good therapy. What's one of the first things they tell you to do in therapy? 

Cory McCray 35:01
Write it down. Yep. 

Rich Bennett 35:02
so technically the same thing. Now, 

Cory McCray 35:04
Now you're 

Rich Bennett 35:05
yourself publisher, you went through a 

Cory McCray 35:06
publisher. So the publisher is Morgan 

Rich Bennett 35:09
Get 

Cory McCray 35:09
James. 

Rich Bennett 35:09
out of 

Cory McCray 35:10
is 

Rich Bennett 35:10
here. And this 

Cory McCray 35:10
your first 

Rich Bennett 35:11
book. 

Cory McCray 35:11
The 

Rich Bennett 35:12
How 

Cory McCray 35:12
first book, 

Rich Bennett 35:13
in the 

Dan Bennett 35:14
yeah. 

Rich Bennett 35:14
hell did you get Morgan James to pick you up? You're listening to the conversations with Rich Bennett. We'll be right back. 

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Cory McCray 36:20
ya know what, I utilize my resources, what you told so I do know some folks that have written books, 

Rich Bennett 36:26
Okay. 

Cory McCray 36:26
and what happens is I reached out to my buddy Chris Wilson, he had taught me and with his agent, and um, Michael Tubbs, he had taught me and with his agent, and Rich, I'll be honest, I think some very tough criticism. 

Rich Bennett 36:37
Oh, yeah. 

Right. 

Cory McCray 36:50
I'll credit my friend Celinda Lake, she has written two books and she was the one to introduce me and made the introduction, um, to Morgan James something. 

Rich Bennett 36:59
Wow! 

Cory McCray 37:00
Beautiful for her, yep. 

Rich Bennett 37:00
Yeah, because, like I said, a lot of the authors I've talked to, the biggest thing you always hear is...

They got to have an agent in 

Cory McCray 37:11
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 37:11
order for a publisher to pick them up, and then 

Cory McCray 37:12
Yep. 

Rich Bennett 37:12
the publishers are like "Well, they got to have an agent, it's like, back 

Cory McCray 37:16
yeah, 

Rich Bennett 37:16
and 

Cory McCray 37:17
yeah". 

Rich Bennett 37:17
forth, 

Cory McCray 37:17
It's definitely... 

Rich Bennett 37:18
Morgan James is a big publishing 

Cory McCray 37:20
the 

Rich Bennett 37:20
company, 

Cory McCray 37:20
space that, like, You just, you gotta, I don't want to say have relationships, but you have, I'll say to us, you got to keep walking towards it. 

Rich Bennett 37:29
yeah. 

Cory McCray 37:29
Eventually you will figure it out from that standpoint. I think one of the things is people get deeter because they just get there, they get to a stuck place and they stop. Don't stop, and I think that's what I've learned in life. I've ran some hard campaigns from a city campaign to a house campaign, but even when I thought that, um, everybody was with me, I still had to fight through that, and we ended up persevering. 

Rich Bennett 37:52
Yeah, running the campaign to launch a book is a lot. And for those of you listening, we're recording this on August 21st. 

Dan Bennett 38:00
Yes. 

Rich Bennett 38:00
And the book comes out in September... September 

Cory McCray 38:04
September 30th, 

Rich Bennett 38:04
30th. 

Cory McCray 38:05
there's some milestones that I just hit so I'll tell you this when, and share some news that I haven't shared with many people. Today, the first event at the main library that'll happen the night of the 29th is already sold out, 

Rich Bennett 38:16
say 

Cory McCray 38:16
so 

Rich Bennett 38:16
"Nice." 

Cory McCray 38:16
they 100, they got capacity, they've already sold to 500. They already got their 500 tickets out the door, and they was like, "Look, we had capacity." So I had to call the second menu, and I didn't want to do them on top of each other, but we're doing a second menu and bought them more, um, to be able to make sure that it's still 30 days, 30 plus... 

Rich Bennett 38:34
Yeah. 

Cory McCray 38:35
And I was like, "I didn't think that would happen." And then the other piece was Rich that every couple weeks I'll check the pre-order book 

Rich Bennett 38:44
then... 

Cory McCray 38:44
sales, and 

Rich Bennett 38:45
Already 

Cory McCray 38:45
40, 45, 100 books that had been 

Rich Bennett 38:47
damn, 

Cory McCray 38:47
which is pretty cool. Like, this is a hell of a... These are things that I just didn't see, and like, when I feel I just feel like every day that I wake up Rich, then I'm always trying my best to think about, how do I make the most of the time, the little bit of time that we're giving here on this Earth, and always trying 

Rich Bennett 39:09
to think about, like, 

Cory McCray 39:10
how do you scale, impact, how do you add value into others? And this is like a unique moment that I stand in with this book to be able to share it, like I said, with God and His Counselors, parental's, because they're trying to figure it out, like, 

Rich Bennett 39:21
mother-- 

Cory McCray 39:21
my 

Rich Bennett 39:21
Yeah. 

Cory McCray 39:21
Figure it out, and be able to say, "Hey, here's a clear path, here's a God book, here's a framework, here's a blueprint, that you can easily read, and then be able to articulate today, young man, or young woman, you're trying to help give die-virection."

Rich Bennett 39:33
45, 100. 

Cory McCray 39:35
45, 100, man. 

Rich Bennett 39:36
That's 

Cory McCray 39:36
That's 

Rich Bennett 39:36
all. 

Cory McCray 39:36
crazy. 

Dan Bennett 39:37
That's 

Cory McCray 39:37
That's 

Dan Bennett 39:37
good. 

Cory McCray 39:37
none. 

Rich Bennett 39:37
Well, you know what? 

Dan Bennett 39:38
that's more than our membership, so 

Cory McCray 39:40
Because 

Dan Bennett 39:40
clearly there's people--

Rich Bennett 39:41
Well, 

Dan Bennett 39:42
outside of what we already know, what we already do, I mean, I already-- 

Cory McCray 39:44
Pre-ordered mine. 

Yep. 

Dan Bennett 39:46
I think I pre-ordered mine through Barnes and Noble. also 

Cory McCray 39:48
Okay. Yep. 

Dan Bennett 39:48
doing, 

Cory McCray 39:48
You're 

Dan Bennett 39:49
what? Good reads, and that's through Snug 

Cory McCray 39:50
books. 

That's how--

Yep, 

Dan Bennett 39:51
yeah. 

Cory McCray 39:51
yep, 

Dan Bennett 39:51
I go to Zeaks, 

Cory McCray 39:52
week. 

Dan Bennett 39:52
like every 

Cory McCray 39:53
Okay, okay. Okay, Thomas is my guy. 

Dan Bennett 39:55
So I might have to get a second one. 

Cory McCray 39:56
Books, yep. That's another thing, too, is that it's very cool to be able to, like, boost the local economy. Like, 

Rich Bennett 40:03
yeah, 

Cory McCray 40:03
I've been able to meet so many great bookstores, Katie over there at Snug books. She just referenced her and sat down with them for a couple hours to be able to understand, how can I help you? 

Rich Bennett 40:13
Yeah. 

Cory McCray 40:14
Standing in this unique moment at the end of the day, like, I want to make sure that I give a platform to all of the folks that's doing this great stuff. And our local bookstores are doing some phenomenal work from that standpoint. 

Rich Bennett 40:24
We need more of them. 

Cory McCray 40:25
And we need more of them. The Ivy bookstore-- I didn't even know you could do, like, sign author copies. But what they did was they said, "Everybody that pre-orders from the Ivy would get a signed author 

Rich Bennett 40:36
copy."

Cory McCray 40:37
And we'll make sure that they go out. We're gonna bring you in a couple days before September 30th. You sign all these books, so I'll be there 

Rich Bennett 40:42
be 

Cory McCray 40:43
and--

Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 40:43
tired. 

Cory McCray 40:43
But the ad 

Rich Bennett 40:44
The ad 

Cory McCray 40:44
will 

Rich Bennett 40:44
will be tired. 

Cory McCray 40:45
But I was like, that's pretty cool, 

Rich Bennett 40:46
It 

Cory McCray 40:46
and I'm 

Rich Bennett 40:46
is. 

Cory McCray 40:47
elevating and lifting up these local spaces, these local stores, 

Rich Bennett 40:50
Yeah. 

Cory McCray 40:51
which is pretty cool. 

Rich Bennett 40:52
That is 

Cory McCray 40:53
awesome. 

Rich Bennett 40:53
good thing--

Well, and the 

Cory McCray 40:54
The 

Rich Bennett 40:54
good thing with your book, because all authors say the hardest part about 

r release, and when the book's released, and even pre-order, is the marketing. 

Cory McCray 41:05
mmmm. 

Rich Bennett 41:05
You got a lot of brothers and sisters behind you that are helping you market, man. 

Cory McCray 41:30
members across the country in Canada. 

Rich Bennett 41:31
Damn. 

Cory McCray 41:32
So like that is pretty cool that my 

Rich Bennett 41:34
and 

Cory McCray 41:34
brothers 

Rich Bennett 41:35
sisters are 

Cory McCray 41:35
lifting this up. And one of the things that I think about when I went on the internet to try to find like who's having a conversation with the folks that are not familiar with our industry. 

Rich Bennett 41:46
Right. 

Cory McCray 41:47
I couldn't find any books. I could not find any books that spoke to apprenticeships in a layman terms way 

Rich Bennett 41:53
Really? 

Cory McCray 41:53
to give direction. And that's why I took action. 

Dan Bennett 41:56
There are a lot of brothers and sisters that we have, or even like non-union guys for that matter and girls. And otherwise, um, could easily write their own memoirs to not even to give you a guidebook on the apprenticeship, but just the stories that they have alone. 

Rich Bennett 42:11
Well, that's what I said. 

Dan Bennett 42:12
Could really get people to be like, I think that's a career that I want. 

Rich Bennett 42:15
That's why he's got a 

Dan Bennett 42:16
get some 

Rich Bennett 42:17
book. Which I think would be 

Dan Bennett 42:18
that'll be 

Rich Bennett 42:19
the fear to write the nest 

Dan Bennett 42:21
because 

Rich Bennett 42:21
this is he got the story. 

Dan Bennett 42:22
This one's the apprenticeship that saved my life and then it transitions to the journeymanship that 

Cory McCray 42:27
Yep. 

Dan Bennett 42:27
ruined me. But therapy. 

Rich Bennett 42:34
Oh God. I 

Dan Bennett 42:36
can always tell who the apprentices are 

Cory McCray 42:38
because 

Rich Bennett 42:39
they're 

Dan Bennett 42:40
smiling. Like at work, 

Rich Bennett 42:42
they're smiling. You don't smile anymore? 

Dan Bennett 42:44
at work. 

Rich Bennett 42:45
Yeah. 

Dan Bennett 42:46
I do. I 

Rich Bennett 42:47
I 

Dan Bennett 42:47
still 

Rich Bennett 42:47
smell all 

Dan Bennett 42:47
do. 

Rich Bennett 42:48
the time when I'm 

Dan Bennett 42:48
Especially on Wednesday. That's when I smile, the widest. 

Cory McCray 42:51
happening on 

Rich Bennett 42:52
What's 

Cory McCray 42:52
Wednesday? I know, but yeah, I was obviously going to say I know, but 

Dan Bennett 42:56
that's one good selling point. Get paid every week. 

Cory McCray 42:59
That was another thing. Most people will get paid every couple of like. So you pay every week. Okay. 

Rich Bennett 43:05
Seeing 

Cory McCray 43:05
you 

Rich Bennett 43:05
if 

Cory McCray 43:05
own 

Rich Bennett 43:06
business, there's times you may not get paid at all. 

Cory McCray 43:09
Sure, too. That is. 

Rich Bennett 43:10
I knew that. 

Cory McCray 43:11
Yep. 

Dan Bennett 43:11
Pay check to paycheck when it's biweekly sucks way harder than weekly. 

Or monthly or 

Rich Bennett 43:20
or whatever 

Dan Bennett 43:20
quarterly 

Rich Bennett 43:20
that's 

Cory McCray 43:20
is just going to be an 

Rich Bennett 43:21
audio form as well. 

Cory McCray 43:23
that is the cool thing, Rich. 

Rich Bennett 43:24
So 

Cory McCray 43:24
First, I've never I've never listened to an audio book. So, like speaking I'm a big reader. I'm an avid reader because I love to mark up my books to kind of understand what resonated with me at that moment. So being able to do the audio book and I still got to work my way through to edit. So I'm going to August 27. I'm going in there to work my way through to edit. So it will be a audible version. It was pretty crazy, like listening to it and reading it from. 

Rich Bennett 43:51
So you are doing the audio, 

Cory McCray 43:52
we are doing the audio book. 

Rich Bennett 43:53
Yeah. It's your voice. 

Cory McCray 43:54
It is my voice. 

Rich Bennett 43:55
good. 

Cory McCray 43:56
Yep. 

Rich Bennett 43:56
Good. 

Cory McCray 43:57
All 

Rich Bennett 43:57
All 

Cory McCray 43:57
right. 

Rich Bennett 43:57
right. So 

Cory McCray 43:57
So 

Rich Bennett 43:58
with the trade, when you got into it, what was your first favorite 

Cory McCray 44:09
tool? I've never been asked this question. 

Dan Bennett 44:11
Yeah. 

Cory McCray 44:11
I don't know if it's the strippers. 

Dan Bennett 44:13
why? 

Rich Bennett 44:14
Why wait a 

Dan Bennett 44:14
Huh. 

Rich Bennett 44:15
minute, Oh, too. Okay. 

Cory McCray 44:19
The. The pliers. I like a flathead over the Phillips. 

Rich Bennett 44:27
Really? 

Dan Bennett 44:27
Oh, as a beater for sure. 

Cory McCray 44:28
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Because you. 

Rich Bennett 44:29
Oh, okay. I'd 

Cory McCray 44:31
definitely say the flathead screwdriver. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 44:33
And what about now? Because your rolls 

Cory McCray 44:36
then. 

Rich Bennett 44:36
changed 

Cory McCray 44:37
Yeah. But in my trunk, I got some pliers. I got I got a tool pouch. I always keep a tool pouch in my trunk, just in case I got a throw them on. But 

Dan Bennett 44:45
every 

Cory McCray 44:45
it's 

Dan Bennett 44:45
now and 

Cory McCray 44:45
certain ones that you can just get away with as long as I got my screwdriver, I got my pliers. I got the strippers. Like I can do some. 

Dan Bennett 44:52
You don't even need a hammer. 

Cory McCray 44:53
Yeah. Yeah. You don't need a hammer. Yeah. I can do a lot of damage with just those three. 

Rich Bennett 44:58
See now I was surprised. Because I thought you would say your favorite tool 

Cory McCray 45:02
now 

Rich Bennett 45:04
is your voice. 

Dan Bennett 45:06
It was a trick question. 

Cory McCray 45:07
It was 

Rich Bennett 45:07
question. 

Cory McCray 45:07
a 

Rich Bennett 45:08
Oh, 

Cory McCray 45:09
trick 

Rich Bennett 45:10
no, 

Cory McCray 45:10
no, 

Rich Bennett 45:11
no, 

Cory McCray 45:11
no, no, no. Really? 

Rich Bennett 45:12
Because, I mean, you're still breaking the tools out, right? 

Cory McCray 45:14
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. The thing that I think about with the voice, I love helping people. 

Rich Bennett 45:22
Mm-hmm. 

Cory McCray 45:22
Rich, unfortunately, when I was coming up, the reason why I got into the apprenticeship was the money. And I realized when I looked to my left and to my right, like, the true measure success or how I would define it is how many people can you get across that finish line with you? 

Rich Bennett 45:35
Yeah. 

Cory McCray 45:35
So when you speak towards the voice piece of it, like service and people just don't know the secret. The secret is the more you give, the more comes back. 

Rich Bennett 45:46
Yes. 

Cory McCray 45:46
10 fold 

Rich Bennett 45:47
Thank you. 

Cory McCray 45:47
and like most people don't know that and I'm like, they like, well, why are you always on? Because what happens is I'm always blessed. I tell folks I'm blessed 10 times over is what I usually say. But what happens is I use my voice just try my best for good. But more importantly, the lift of a folks up, similar to what we were doing with I, these similar what we were doing with snugs, things of that nature is like how you elevate. And it's it's it's it's such a good space when you can just sit here when it's three instead of one. 

Dan Bennett 46:12
Mm hmm. 

Rich Bennett 46:13
Throughout the years, mentors change. Mm hmm. We always 

Cory McCray 46:16
have different. Very much though. 

Rich Bennett 46:18
I've had several. 

Cory McCray 46:21
Mm hmm. A 

Rich Bennett 46:21
lot of them today. I had never even thought of you. I didn't even know 

Cory McCray 46:26
ago. 

Rich Bennett 46:26
years 

Cory McCray 46:27
Mm hmm. 

Rich Bennett 46:28
So today because I think when you were younger, who was he? Say your 

Cory McCray 46:33
I always say my brother. was 

Rich Bennett 46:34
brother. 

Cory McCray 46:34
pretty much, yeah, it was it was the older folks in my neighborhood that I grew up with that, you know, might not have always been doing the right thing, but was trying to get me to fully understand like, here's how you. 

Rich Bennett 46:46
Okay, as an author pernor. 

Cory McCray 46:48
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 46:49
Who was your big? Oh, it's true. I mean, that's 

Dan Bennett 46:51
author per Nor. 

Cory McCray 46:52
That's the first time I heard it, but it's good. It is good. 

Rich Bennett 46:55
As an author, it is a business. You're trying to sell your book. 

Cory McCray 46:58
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 46:59
Arthur pernor. 

Cory McCray 47:00
Mm 

Dan Bennett 47:00
hmm. 

Rich Bennett 47:00
When 

Dan Bennett 47:00
Like it. 

Rich Bennett 47:02
it comes to that, who was who would you say your. 

Cory McCray 47:04
it was a young man, Chris Wilson. We had went through a number of similar channels. Now he had grew up on a 

Rich Bennett 47:12
Oh, yeah, 

Cory McCray 47:12
DC side of Maryland and he's about three or four years older than me. So when we talked about some of the juvenile facilities in the state of Maryland, he had went through that same experience. So as I read his book, I was like, man, 

Rich Bennett 47:25
there. 

Cory McCray 47:25
I was But then I was thinking like he was three, four years older than me. So we wouldn't have ran across each other's path, but very, very similar stories. 

Rich Bennett 47:34
Right. 

Cory McCray 47:34
Just trying to figure it out. Unfortunately, he took a deeper term because he ended up in a dope 

Rich Bennett 47:41
and giving 

Cory McCray 47:42
up about 10, 

Rich Bennett 47:43
12 years 

Cory McCray 47:43
his 

Rich Bennett 47:44
of 

Cory McCray 47:44
life. 

Rich Bennett 47:44
like, yeah, wow. 

Cory McCray 47:45
So, So that then from, but what happens is he came home and Rich, I can remember when Chris came home. So I can remember him just returning home, but he had such a burst of energy and like a level of determination in such a short time for his book came out back in 2020. So to see him. Yeah. Yeah. So to see him at this moment and being able to ask him for advice, like, this 

Rich Bennett 48:14
Yeah. 

Cory McCray 48:14
is the person. Hey, help me understand what did you do in this situation, but he's been such a great mentor, helping me navigate some of the spaces also just saying, like, don't be afraid. Don't, don't, don't try new things. Like if they got that, you 

Rich Bennett 48:27
do. 

Cory McCray 48:27
can Yeah. That's what happens is when you see yourself, you don't always see yourself as this. You see yourself in this space and like, this is how it's supposed to move. When I found out there, we sold $4, 500. I was like, man, I was thinking 1,000 or 2,000, you know, but then I'm like, how the hell did you 

Rich Bennett 48:42
do 

Cory McCray 48:43
that? And when I got 

Rich Bennett 48:44
to overwhelming, 

Cory McCray 48:45
it is a lot to take in. When they told me the first event was sold out, I actually said, can you give me your phone number at the main library so that I can talk you and get an understanding of, like, what do you mean my sold out 

Dan Bennett 48:57
like, 

Cory McCray 48:58
is the number for sold out? Cause that doesn't feel 

Rich Bennett 49:01
what 

Cory McCray 49:01
real. And like, so that's what I'm kind of going through and churning through at this moment is a lot of these first, first as an author, but first as I didn't set my goal. And that's what I tell these young folks. When I tell them, and I speak to them, I said, dream about the things that's unimaginable, the stuff that I was telling you. And I'm excited when I say it to you, cause I couldn't even see it. And, and that's how we, that like, that's really what I feel like is fully living. And I think that all this has happened is because I just keep giving, keep giving, keep extending, keep figuring out from that standpoint and just being blessed. 

Rich Bennett 49:35
Speaking of giving and speaking, do you go and talk to the kids at the Department of Juvenile Services or even the prisons? 

Cory McCray 49:46
The 

Rich Bennett 49:46
end will your books be there. 

Cory McCray 49:48
Yup, yup, yup. So I do stay in at least one of my schools once a week. So multiple times. So if you look, Rich, I'm at every graduation, as the graduation speaker, or things of that nature, because I know what's that stake. 

Rich Bennett 50:00
Right? 

Cory McCray 50:00
I know that if I believe in a Corey McCray at 1615, even if he's doing something wrong, that they're still potential in that person, I just need to get them to understand that full potential. So I'm always around them and I'll tell you this, and this is just me being vulnerable and open. I do not find myself in the juvenile spaces, in the detention centers, as much as I should, 'cause it brings back bad memories. I have talked with Carolyn Skrug, who's our Secretary of Public Safety. I have talked to Betsy. I'm drawing a blank on Betsy, so it was the head of DJS. And I can find myself, like, I know I have to get there, but that's one of the moments where I have to figure out my level of courage. 

Rich Bennett 50:42
One step at a 

Cory McCray 50:43
Yeah, 

Rich Bennett 50:43
time, 

Cory McCray 50:43
'cause I've endured so much during those moments that, and I did it once, and what happens is you have to turn in so much information to be able to go through it. I almost felt like I was incarcerated 

Rich Bennett 50:55
right. 

Cory McCray 50:55
again, just going through the process of going to speak to folks, you know, shutting the gate, hanging, and it just, I was like, it was such an experience. I was like, man, this is, I want to be so far away from this, 'cause it just brings back a, a challenge a moment during my life that I haven't found myself going. And I know I need to. I do know that I need to do it, 'cause there's people inside the walls that need to be able to hear, and you asked the question, is the book, so we've already worked with a vendor, what happens is there are systems, electronic systems, where they have tablets, things in that nature, 

Rich Bennett 51:27
Right, 

Cory McCray 51:28
where it will be accessible as a vehicle for folks that are incarcerated. 

Rich Bennett 51:33
good, 

Cory McCray 51:33
And I just look forward to working with the two secretaries to figure that puzzle out, but I also have to man up and kind of get the courage to be able to do that. And I haven't been in, probably, I want to say five, or six years ago, I tried it, did it, and just, I think, I think either University of Baltimore, or Towson had a program, and I want to speak to folks that were going, trying to get a degree, while they were 

Rich Bennett 51:53
good. 

Right. 

Cory McCray 51:53
incarcerated, did it that once, and it just was challenging for me. 

Rich Bennett 51:56
And I don't know if you're speaking at these places yet or not, or even if the books are going to be there, but I just talking to so many of 

Cory McCray 52:05
them, 

Rich Bennett 52:05
I know it would be a big help. The 

Cory McCray 52:09
The recovery 

Rich Bennett 52:09
recovery 

Cory McCray 52:10
centers or treatments centers. 

Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. I visit out treatment centers, because we got a number, I'm just in the Baltimore region, 

Rich Bennett 52:16
centers, 

Cory McCray 52:16
but I do frequent the treatment centers, because I actually think that that's a population, that's trying their best to 

Rich Bennett 52:23
right. 

Cory McCray 52:24
figure it out, 

Rich Bennett 52:24
Yeah. 

Cory McCray 52:25
and a lot of the things that I've learned, 'cause you gotta remember, I had to reprogram myself, like a lot of the stuff that was learned habits, I had to then just be able to sustain, 

Rich Bennett 52:33
able to--

Cory McCray 52:33
just to be 

Rich Bennett 52:33
Right, 

Cory McCray 52:34
The disciplines from that standpoint, and then sharing with them, how do you navigate? Rich, I'm here because I want to be here, but I also find myself where I don't put myself in situations, or spend time around folks that aren't going to add some level of value, 

Rich Bennett 52:49
right. 

Cory McCray 52:49
or, or some like those are things that you have to learn. Nobody's like teaching you this, if everybody in your circle is moving in that one direction, but you have to learn those disciplines. So people on recovery, I frequent those places, 'cause I'm trying my best to share with them, the knowledge 

Rich Bennett 53:03
Good. 

Cory McCray 53:04
capture that I've learned over the last couple. 

Rich Bennett 53:05
Well, and 

Cory McCray 53:06
is, 

Rich Bennett 53:06
the thing 

Cory McCray 53:06
and we've 

Rich Bennett 53:07
talked about this several times, there are several businesses now, and even the unions, that are, it's people 

Cory McCray 53:21
that aren't 

Rich Bennett 53:22
recovery 

Cory McCray 53:22
in 

Rich Bennett 53:22
when they--

When they join them, it's saving their life. 

Cory McCray 53:24
Yeah, yeah, 

Rich Bennett 53:25
yeah, 

Cory McCray 53:26
yeah, 

Rich Bennett 53:26
and, you and, you, we mentioned it's not too long ago, 

Cory McCray 53:30
know, 

Rich Bennett 53:30
but, because addiction doesn't have a face. 

Cory McCray 53:33
Mm-hmm. 

Rich Bennett 53:34
You look at how many CEOs, business 

Cory McCray 53:37
owners--

Yep, that's sure. 

Rich Bennett 53:38
And actors, whatever, are in addiction. So you can't put a face on it, but they do need help, and I think this, you know, because there are a lot of people, they don't know what they're true 

Cory McCray 53:51
it. 

Rich Bennett 53:51
calling 

Cory McCray 53:51
Yep, yep. 

Rich Bennett 53:52
And, I've always said, I miss Mike, as I always wanted to be a chef. I wanted to go to culinary school. 

Cory McCray 54:00
Okay. 

Rich Bennett 54:00
I'm glad I did it, because then when I found out that chefs, one of the highest dressed jobs 

Cory McCray 54:07
there, 

Rich Bennett 54:07
out 

Cory McCray 54:07
Oh, why? 

Rich Bennett 54:07
Oh, yeah, when it comes to mental anxiety, oh, yeah, it's ridiculous. It's like, "Hey, no, never mind." So, yeah, it's like, now, I'll stick with what I'm doing. 

Now, 

Cory McCray 54:18
go back to one point. I just wanna unpack something, and it's more for the listener audience. I know you got it, but just for the listener audience, when I talk about disciplines, when I talk about habits, so I remember going through the 

Rich Bennett 54:30
appreciation. 

Cory McCray 54:31
remember going through the apprenticeship, so I'm a working man at this point in time, but what happens is if you're not doing something constructed with that time. I remember going back to the same blocks that I was familiar with after I got off of work. 

Rich Bennett 54:42
I 

Cory McCray 54:42
What happens is I would still get like a load or a shooting dice charge and I had to remove myself in totality away from that situation. So when I talk about disciplines or things and that structure, that's what I'm trying to share. I didn't know if I articulated that the way I was supposed to, but I wanted to lay it out. You could be doing everything right, but you could be doing everything right and put yourself in bad situations and find yourself that now jeopardize and everything else good that you have 

Rich Bennett 55:10
on. 

Cory McCray 55:11
going 

Rich Bennett 55:11
Well, how long did it take you to get out of that environment? 

Cory McCray 55:14
I want to say probably around my third or fourth year, I just got it. I had 

Rich Bennett 55:21
it. 

Cory McCray 55:21
to do 

Rich Bennett 55:22
Which is when you said that's when the coaching started 

Cory McCray 55:24
The 

Rich Bennett 55:24
right? light bulb went off in 

Cory McCray 55:28
Somebody stays, you're not going to immediately get 

Rich Bennett 55:30
your head. 

Cory McCray 55:30
but over a couple of times, when you're just don't be able to see the board is clear, but then you start to understand, I have to do this. And what happens is people are now counting on you when you have family members count on you. I had my first child after the apprenticeship, but like my first child helped grow me up very quickly, because 

Rich Bennett 55:47
wasn't 

Cory McCray 55:47
now, I just me that I had to think 

Rich Bennett 55:50
about I said growing up, because you saw a lot of your friends and some that probably weren't friends go through the same stuff that you did. Do you have any of them have actually gone through 

Cory McCray 56:03
your 

Rich Bennett 56:04
apprenticeship program after you? 

Cory McCray 56:05
No, I actually the beef introduction, the introduction lays out how one of my friends called me. My brother told him to give me a quarter. I just graduated the apprenticeship. I get this phone call from one of my homeboys that it just came home and he's telling me and I tell folks, there's this small I'm very small, when a person's trying to change their life, they don't have three, four months 

Rich Bennett 56:31
No, 

Cory McCray 56:32
eternity. There's a window when someone's asking for help, and you can either offer the help or you cannot help, but like that window then closes. 

Rich Bennett 56:39
yeah, 

Cory McCray 56:40
So I get this call from a friend, and he's asked me, hey, your brother told me you went through this apprenticeship program, and I didn't see myself as a mentor when I first graduated. I'm going to tell you I was very quiet, I paid attention, I just didn't do a lot of talking, and he calls and I say, hey, here's the address, here's where you can fill out an application, he did that. He wasn't immediately accepted in, he didn't have a high school diploma. What he did was, he went through the CW program, so the CW program, you don't have to have the high school diploma. He's like a helper, so we call it construction worker, but it's like almost like a apprentice 

Rich Bennett 57:13
okay. 

Cory McCray 57:13
helper, so he went through what we call the CW program, and he got a GD, you need a GD or high school diploma to get into the apprenticeship, he gets 

Rich Bennett 57:23
the... 

Cory McCray 57:23
into actually fails out, so he fails out, he's still working, I think it was Gil Simpson at the time, so he's working with Gil Simpson, folks are saying phenomenal worker, and I tell folks, I was like look, if you know how to figure out, and navigate the drug world, 

Rich Bennett 57:37
He 

Cory McCray 57:38
low enforcement, I'm pretty sure that you could do eight hours on a job site, and 

Rich Bennett 57:43
those are the ones that sometimes make your best times 

Cory McCray 57:45
So 

Rich Bennett 57:45
your reflectors. 

Cory McCray 57:47
what then happens is, he fails out the program, and then I get to see him, he re-eners into it, so he gets back in the folks wrote letters for him to be able to get it, but I clearly say where I fell short at. I said if I was ready, I could have been a better mentor, and that's when I'm trying my best to do at this moment for people like him that's making that call, taking that first step, and I would have just held his hand a little bit tighter versus dropping him off and say, "Do this." 

Rich Bennett 58:15
From 

Cory McCray 58:16
that standpoint, I would have did a little bit more engagement, and that's my attempt right now. 

Rich Bennett 58:19
Do you know how he's doing now? 

Cory McCray 58:22
He's doing well. I see him in a local. I feel real good about it, and it ain't just him. It's a number of 

Rich Bennett 58:28
folks 

Cory McCray 58:29
that will call and say, "Hey, how do you find out about this that I've grown up with?" And then I just don't know electricians, I got one friend that's in the plumbers of steam feeders, and I'm telling you, folks will 

Rich Bennett 58:39
say, "They 

Cory McCray 58:41
just didn't do the book part. They were like, "Man, where I'm 

Rich Bennett 58:42
good." 

Cory McCray 58:43
so Did it because like this shifted my trajectory, too. "Season 

Rich Bennett 58:49
there, you 

Cory McCray 58:49
were hurt." You've pretty much pulled every chapter. You don't want namentals. Call people, you don't want to hear. Like if you had a friend that went through it, so like, "I 

Rich Bennett 58:57
can't wait to get this because I love being a mentor." 

Cory McCray 59:01
And 

Rich Bennett 59:02
I love my mentors as 

Cory McCray 59:04
Same 

Rich Bennett 59:04
well. 

Cory McCray 59:04
here. 

Rich Bennett 59:05
But you learn so much. 

Cory McCray 59:09
Mm-hmm. 

Rich Bennett 59:10
and I just love learning, 

Cory McCray 59:13
and you get there 

Rich Bennett 59:14
get. 

Cory McCray 59:14
faster, you 

Rich Bennett 59:15
Yes, 

Cory McCray 59:15
yes. Faster, because you can cheat the mistakes that they tell you not to make. 

Rich Bennett 59:18
Yup. 

Cory McCray 59:19
thing. If you're listening. 

Rich Bennett 59:21
Yes. That's 

Cory McCray 59:21
If you value, 

Rich Bennett 59:22
the big 

Cory McCray 59:23
if you're 

Rich Bennett 59:23
I 

Cory McCray 59:23
listening. 

Rich Bennett 59:23
don't listen. 

Cory McCray 59:24
Yes. 

Rich Bennett 59:25
And if there's another thing too and, um, and I'm sure you guys run into all the time, especially being electricians, you run into a problem sometimes that you can't solve it. But you're determined to solve it. Yeah, because it's a challenge. 

Cory McCray 59:43
Yep. 

Rich Bennett 59:43
Love 

Cory McCray 59:43
Yep. 

Dan Bennett 59:44
It's 

Rich Bennett 59:44
challenge. 

Dan Bennett 59:44
really the 

Cory McCray 59:45
Yeah. 

Dan Bennett 59:45
difference between an apprentice and a journeyman like there's plenty of apprentices who can do the same job that a journeyman does, but once it goes wrong. Like, 

Rich Bennett 59:52
yeah. 

Dan Bennett 59:53
Mm-hmm. We get paid, I guess we get paid more for our experience rather than the task at hand. You know, an apprentice or a journeyman could equally easily be tasked with wire up that receptacle, push a broom around for two hours, wire up this switch gear for me. But like, yeah, going through the apprenticeship teaches you a lot of how to improvise when shit hits the fan 

Rich Bennett 1:00:16
Mm-hmm. 

Dan Bennett 1:00:16
and things go wrong. It's one of the valuable skills that gets, uh, more solidified with you. Because I mean, I already knew improvisation from being a musician, but then like, this is like an actual mechanical skill. Well, so, as meant, I guess, 

Rich Bennett 1:00:31
I tell you one thing, the union keeps my 

Cory McCray 1:00:33
son busy 

Rich Bennett 1:00:34
I can never any move from my house 

Cory McCray 1:00:36
because 

Rich Bennett 1:00:36
to help you do electrical work for me and let's all offer food or drink or something. 

Cory McCray 1:00:40
It's a, it's a good, We, we, we stand in a very unique space across the country, 

Rich Bennett 1:00:45
yeah. 

Cory McCray 1:00:45
like a lot of locals are dealing with this. Um, child, but it's a good challenge. 

Rich Bennett 1:00:49
Well, Dan, you have any more questions before I get to my last question? 

Dan Bennett 1:00:53
Oh, I did think of one. Yeah, um, 

Rich Bennett 1:00:55
one. 

Dan Bennett 1:00:56
Yeah, I mean, several, but, um, were there any apprentices that went through the program with you at that time? Like, you said that you made a big change in third years when you got your house. Were there any who had like that similar, um, trajectory alongside you who might have also gotten a new house or a new car 

Cory McCray 1:01:15
Mm-hmm. 

Dan Bennett 1:01:15
or, you know, a new boo, whatever, new kid? Uh, I mean, it happens like we all. 

Cory McCray 1:01:20
Yeah, yeah, 

Dan Bennett 1:01:21
Way 

Cory McCray 1:01:21
yeah. 

Dan Bennett 1:01:22
different age brackets. 

Rich Bennett 1:01:23
I'm going to tell you something right now, son, you get a new boo on your kick your ass. 

Dan Bennett 1:01:26
No. No. Well, I did in the apprenticeship. I met Stephanie when I was a first year. 

Rich Bennett 1:01:30
Oh, oh. 

Dan Bennett 1:01:31
Yeah. 

Cory McCray 1:01:31
Okay. 

Dan Bennett 1:01:31
Yeah. Like when I first got in, I had just been dumped. I was kind of miserable. I mean, I could say it saved my life, too, just for different reasons and different, uh, Outcomes. But what I was getting at is are there apprentices, apprentices who became like lifelong friends and brothers with 

Cory McCray 1:01:46
yeah. 

Dan Bennett 1:01:46
you who you could also 

Cory McCray 1:01:47
Yeah. 

Dan Bennett 1:01:47
consider 

Cory McCray 1:01:47
Yeah. 

Dan Bennett 1:01:47
your mentor? 

Cory McCray 1:01:48
Yeah, I would definitely say my class. I had a phenomenal class and I think that's the best thing about the brotherhood is, is like those folks that you go through that. With like your traveling at Jorn that five 

Dan Bennett 1:01:59
what 

Cory McCray 1:01:59
years is And, um, I'm going to lean into one that stuck out. Um, you know, I'm done. Um, his name is Jerome Miller. I give him thanks and praise at the end. He's our financial secretary, uh, fell a local union. Rich, I'm not witty and Jerome can like three seconds. He has a joke. He has this. 

Rich Bennett 1:02:18
He has, so he could be 

Cory McCray 1:02:18
standup comedian, 

Rich Bennett 1:02:19
a 

Cory McCray 1:02:19
he could be a standup comedian. And I can remember, Jerome was brilliant. Like Jerome was pretty smart. He went to the school Polly. Polly is a big, but more. And what happens is Jerome had failed the first D first to. So while I talk about me failing to test though my first year, he failed D first. And I laughed at him because I knew he had already, um, what it takes and he could have easily passed it. So when I look at it, like us, maybe not taking it in a serious, but like him traveling in it, when you talk about the house, I remember by my first house as a apprentice, because I saved my money. Like as a first year apprentice, I saved my money. I couldn't believe that I got in this wage, the $12, it wasn't a $15, but what happens is a number of my. mates had saw me. I think I was every year that we got 

Rich Bennett 1:03:04
a 

Cory McCray 1:03:04
to raise. I bought and what then happens. They would see you and they would say the same thing I was saying about them, Jeric, that journey, man, if Corey can do it, I can do it too. So I can remember Jerome picking up the house on Orlando, probably right before we were about the top out. Something because it's like, you're not going to keep letting Rich. 

Rich Bennett 1:03:22
Right. 

Cory McCray 1:03:22
Keep showing me. And they just around you too much. It's inevitable for something to kind of pin love. I can remember my buddy Dave. He just started his own company from that same point. I can remember when he first and a lot of them would call me and say, Hey, because sometimes you don't have people in your family that have done this. So now you got to figure out like who do I know that know about home inspections, that know about finding the right real or to, that know about like these types of different things. And then they're just duplicating the process. 

Rich Bennett 1:03:50
I actually, I do have a question for you. I just, uh, because you hear about people that go through the apprenticeship program, their members of the union and everything, and you just mentioned that the one guy started his own business. 

Cory McCray 1:04:16
He was a, uh, a foreman, things of that nature. What happens is you're then learning these other technical skills that it takes to run the respective business. He did a, he, he had did a lot of side work, um, during that, during that 

Rich Bennett 1:04:27
for. 

Cory McCray 1:04:28
time, as he's working And then eventually he figured out how to go out on his own and then he came in and he was what we call a signatory contractor. So now he has agreement with the local I'm 

Rich Bennett 1:04:40
union. 

Cory McCray 1:04:41
going to pick my manpower up from the local union. Why was something like that benefit day when you're thinking about healthcare? So 

Rich Bennett 1:04:48
Yeah, 

Cory McCray 1:04:48
like because we have a self-funded system it now benefits the employer from being able to join, especially a small contractor that may have three or five employees to be able to join a big system from that standpoint. Retirement. So let's say the business doesn't go well. I pray that it does go well, but he's still paying into his annuity, he's still paying into his pension and thinking about those types of things from that standpoint. And he's doing that for his employees that work for him. So like that's how Dave Martin had gotta education from the JTC eventually worked his way through the company. I can't remember I think it might have been one free state, but worked his way through the company, learning other technical 

Rich Bennett 1:05:25
yeah. 

Cory McCray 1:05:25
skills. Everybody don't want to venture off and be a senator or a delegate, but an entrepreneur or company or own a electrical company, but he did want to do that and he had 

Rich Bennett 1:05:34
all the 

Cory McCray 1:05:34
learned 

Rich Bennett 1:05:34
word 

Cory McCray 1:05:35
for a period of time went out on his own for a period of time and then came 

Rich Bennett 1:05:39
and 

Cory McCray 1:05:40
became a signatory contractor. 

Rich Bennett 1:05:41
All right, so let's say my business becomes part of the union. Does this mean my employees are members of the union even the secretaries and all that, 

Cory McCray 1:05:55
You 

Rich Bennett 1:05:55
or did they? 

Cory McCray 1:05:56
get through the technical piece of it. So if they are electrician, yes, they will be. So they will get what we call organized in from that standpoint. Because we also do data. Data work when I say that data mean like telecom, but there have been contractors that have had employees that didn't go throughout school and it didn't become members. Now when you get to the clerical staff, this is where it gets a little bit tricky because you're getting into the weeds of it. So there are different classifications of employees. So you have some folks that we consider management. So management is a different tier, but also clerical is a different tier two. So they may belong to like a OPIU or different things like that. But the folks that are out there in the field for the company would be a part of Ali Reo. 

Yeah, I heard office, professional 

Rich Bennett 1:06:46
yeah. Okay. Jesus. 

Cory McCray 1:06:47
employees in the 

Rich Bennett 1:06:48
You 

Cory McCray 1:06:48
national. 

Rich Bennett 1:06:48
said that on the son of the song, what's up with OPP 

Cory McCray 1:06:50
And I 

Rich Bennett 1:06:51
just 

Cory McCray 1:06:51
piles, 

Rich Bennett 1:06:51
jumped in my head? 

Cory McCray 1:06:52
yeah, 

Rich Bennett 1:06:53
It's like 

Cory McCray 1:06:53
For 

Rich Bennett 1:06:54
God. 

Cory McCray 1:06:54
them like I made it seem like everybody 

Rich Bennett 1:06:57
That's 

Cory McCray 1:06:57
in the audience. 

Rich Bennett 1:06:58
all right. I do it all the time. When I was in the IT field, I'd be told that people dropping the terms in their 

Cory McCray 1:07:03
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 1:07:03
life. 

Cory McCray 1:07:03
Yep. 

Rich Bennett 1:07:05
Yeah. What? 

Cory McCray 1:07:06
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 1:07:07
So the very before I get to my last question, so the 

Cory McCray 1:07:10
He'd 

Rich Bennett 1:07:10
very. 

Cory McCray 1:07:10
have been at last question like four questions ago. Dad, I'm just making 

Rich Bennett 1:07:13
normal. 

Cory McCray 1:07:13
I'm not sure what you're 

Rich Bennett 1:07:14
Did 

Cory McCray 1:07:14
at. 

Rich Bennett 1:07:14
you have another question? 

Dan Bennett 1:07:16
No, but I could do this all day. 

Cory McCray 1:07:17
I 

Rich Bennett 1:07:18
got. I got to pick your sister off from work. So I can't. 

Dan Bennett 1:07:22
She can all. 

Rich Bennett 1:07:23
So the very important. Tell everybody the website and how they can get the book. 

Cory McCray 1:07:27
Okay. Okay. You're laughing at this rich. I call it the apprenticeship cheat code. So the apprenticeship cheat code.com is how you find a book. It's all vehicles. Please. 

Go to local bookstores. It's Amazon, Barnes and nobles. Books. A million. Wherever you want to find the book at, you'll be able to find it and be able to preorder from that standpoint. But I look at 

Rich Bennett 1:07:49
the. 

Cory McCray 1:07:49
it as All information. 

Rich Bennett 1:07:51
Right. 

Cory McCray 1:07:52
You think that I know is in that specific book and try my best, like I said, in layman's terms, not the way you have to stress your brain, tryna figure out what I'm saying, exactly how we were on the show, articulating that through a reading experience that you can keep coming back to, you can keep coming back doing what I'm saying. Hey, what was it that drove the wage structure, being able to clearly articulate, why was some of the benefits, being able to have some level of mentorship? How do you navigate difficult people? Who's some of the folks in some of the experiences that he's enduring while he's going through this process? We laid out some of the benefits of the premier with a, a, a young in a apprenticeship versus what is an on you in partnership, we dig into pre-apprenticeship, who needs pre-apprenticeship versus why you can just go directly to the labor union and be able to fill out the application, land out all those different spaces in a very quick way, ten chapters, plus a introduction that you can have as a reference in a God book. 

Rich Bennett 1:08:46
So those of you listening, when you purchase the book, after you read it, make sure you leave a forward view, whether it be on Goodreads, Amazon, wherever, 

Cory McCray 1:08:55
yeah, 

Rich Bennett 1:08:56
and then don't pass the book on instead because it's a guidebook, you want to keep it. Purchase it for other people that you know, matter of fact, I'm going to challenge you now. If you know of any recovery centers, any schools, wherever, purchase it for them and give it to them as well. Alright, you know how this works, I told you before we started. I'm going have to have fun with this. 

Cory McCray 1:09:23
Should 

Rich Bennett 1:09:23
I leave Danny do one too? 

Cory McCray 1:09:25
Daddy should do one. 

Rich Bennett 1:09:26
Alright, pick Danny. We'll do you first. Pick a number between one and a hundred and tell me why you picked that number after I look for the question. Well, I'm looking for the question. 

Dan Bennett 1:09:34
No, you know, you're going to have two or three, I'll let you guess 

Rich Bennett 1:09:37
why. Yeah, why boring one? Alright, 

Dan Bennett 1:09:41
sorry that the day I was born, 

Rich Bennett 1:09:42
I know. I'm 

Dan Bennett 1:09:43
Michael Jordan. 

Rich Bennett 1:09:44
And the question, the question. 

Dan Bennett 1:09:46
And Willis McGay, he 

Rich Bennett 1:09:47
is a scary question to ask you. What's a part of yourself that you're still exploring or trying to understand? 

Dan Bennett 1:09:54
Where are you me? Oh Lord. Now, a part of myself that I'm exploring or trying to understand. 

Rich Bennett 1:10:02
I mean 

Dan Bennett 1:10:02
constantly my 

Cory McCray 1:10:04
mind. 

Rich Bennett 1:10:06
I don't think any of us will ever understand, 

Cory McCray 1:10:08
it's a that. 

Dan Bennett 1:10:10
Yeah. I 

Cory McCray 1:10:10
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 1:10:10
you 

Dan Bennett 1:10:10
mean, 

Rich Bennett 1:10:11
should always be 

Dan Bennett 1:10:12
Yeah, the more 

Cory McCray 1:10:12
exploring. 

Dan Bennett 1:10:12
you learn, the more you unlock. 

Rich Bennett 1:10:15
So 

Dan Bennett 1:10:16
that in general. I guess that is a boring one, isn't 

Cory McCray 1:10:20
it? No, 

Rich Bennett 1:10:20
no, no, I know. I'm always afraid of your, for a while, I would always ask in the group. I would ask, 

Dan Bennett 1:10:26
I 

Rich Bennett 1:10:26
if 

Dan Bennett 1:10:26
went or depth with 

Rich Bennett 1:10:28
that with questions, 

Cory McCray 1:10:28
and 

Rich Bennett 1:10:29
some of the questions that he submitted were just like scary. Very 

Cory McCray 1:10:34
scary. Did you read about 

Rich Bennett 1:10:35
that? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. The funny, some of my guests are like, oh yeah, I can answer that and some of them were like, what the hell's he 

Dan Bennett 1:10:44
talking to? 

Rich Bennett 1:10:46
All right. So Corey, pick a number between one and 100. 

Cory McCray 1:10:49
I'm going to go one more in front of Dan since we have been talking about 24 for a couple of times. 

Dan Bennett 1:10:56
That makes sense. That does make sense. 

Rich Bennett 1:10:59
And now I can't, if I should have stayed on that page. 

Cory McCray 1:11:01
But that is pretty cool. A question for each one. 

Dan Bennett 1:11:03
Jordan Jacobi. 

Rich Bennett 1:11:10
Damn, this does, this lines up what we've been talking 

Cory McCray 1:11:13
about. In 

Rich Bennett 1:11:14
a way, what's something you've come to appreciate more as you've gotten older? 

Cory McCray 1:11:23
Family, 

Rich Bennett 1:11:28
family. That's. You know what? I'm glad you said that because a lot of people don't. 

Dan Bennett 1:11:32
A 

Rich Bennett 1:11:33
lot of people do not appreciate their family. 

Cory McCray 1:11:35
I'm so blessed. I'm so blessed. Rich, I'll leave you with this. I think about my four kids. And so much that I've been able to absorb and learn over a period of time that I And I've, I've, I speak to this in a book 

Rich Bennett 1:11:50
understand. 

Cory McCray 1:11:50
about Frank Vicer and how much he appreciated family. But I went and researched because I'd only know my immediate, I knew my grandmother, but if you actually, any extension past that, and what happens is we had did a genealogy report and was able to come back always to like the 1800s. And 

Rich Bennett 1:12:07
Wow. 

Cory McCray 1:12:07
we had pictures of six generation of women in my family, which was pretty cool. And being able to commission a painting where all of them are put in one photo. So that every day to my daughter's wake up, they can be clear about something I did not know, but who their grandmother was, their great-grandmother, 

Rich Bennett 1:12:31
their great-great-grandmother 

Cory McCray 1:12:31
was. And like that is one of the dopest experiences. But I feel like as a man, my responsibility is immediately to my family. then I have a responsibility to extend out to my community and try your best to do and everybody that's impacting your family and trying to make and I just think about this in the way in the context just like how do you raise good human beings that are going to contribute to this space and make other people better and make themselves better so I'm going to go back and net one word as family. 

Rich Bennett 1:13:01
Perfect for you to end. Cory I want to thank you so much it's been an honor and Dan you did good. 

Cory McCray 1:13:08
you. Yeah you did yeah you did. No just thank you both for this opportunity like I really really had a good time. I just appreciate the brotherhood 

Dan Bennett 1:13:16
Oh yeah 

Cory McCray 1:13:17
just what you do for the local 

Dan Bennett 1:13:18
well 

Cory McCray 1:13:18
Union but 

Dan Bennett 1:13:18
thank 

Cory McCray 1:13:19
more importantly Rich like this was a beautiful experience. It was pretty cool. 

Dan Bennett 1:13:22
What was really only what a two-year gap between when I joined and when you got elected to House first. 

Cory McCray 1:13:27
Yeah the House. Yep the House of Delhi. 

Dan Bennett 1:13:29
We never met each other in the field and so it's really only been select occasions where we get to interact with each other. I think there has been a bar once or twice but yeah I mean this has been probably the longest we've sat down 

Cory McCray 1:13:42
Yep. 

Dan Bennett 1:13:42
and talked and I'm just 

Cory McCray 1:13:43
enjoyed every 

Dan Bennett 1:13:43
it. 

Cory McCray 1:13:44
minute 

Dan Bennett 1:13:44
It's been 

Cory McCray 1:13:44
of 

Dan Bennett 1:13:44
all for 

Cory McCray 1:13:45
every minute. 

Rich Bennett 1:13:46
So what I'm hearing is that you're going to be bringing Cory when we starting him up again to a bourbon night. 

Dan Bennett 1:13:51
It could. It could happen. 

Rich Bennett 1:13:54
Thank you for listening to the Conversations with Rich Bennett. I hope you enjoyed today's episode and learned something from it as I did. If you'd like to hear more conversations like this be sure to subscribe to the podcast so you never miss an episode and if you have a moment I'd love it if you could leave a review. It helps us reach more listeners and share more incredible stories. Don't forget to connect with us on social media or visit our website at ConversationsWithRichbendit.com for updates, giveaways and more. Until next time take care be kind and keep the conversations going. You know it takes a lot to put a podcast together together, and my sponsors help add a lot but I also have some supporters that actually help me when it comes to the editing software the hosting and so forth. There's a lot that goes into putting this together so I want to thank them and if you can please please visit their websites, visit their businesses, support them however you can. So please visit the following. Full Full circle boards, nobody does charcuterie like full circle boards visit them at fullcircleboards.com. Sincerely, Sincerely, Sincerely Sawyer Photography. Live in the moment they'll capture it. Visit them at sincerelysoyer.com